The Plextor RW Drive "-usefua" testing thread ...

[greynol]

To those of you who have found -usefua doesn't work correctly with EAC, do you have DAEMON Tools installed on your system?

I have discovered that the installation of SPTD (SCSI Pass Through Direct) on my system has prohibited -usefua from working.

After removing SPTD, -usefua is working once again.

You can remove it by your system by downloading the installer and typing "sptdinst_x86.exe remove" at the command prompt. Typing "sptdinst_x86.exe add" will re-install it.

sptdinst_x86.exe can be downloaded at this site.

[DT5]

Yes I had the Daemon Tools installed that time. So that could be the reason.

[KusanagiSan1]

My test with the new SPTD v1.47 beta:

Test drive: PX-760A with the latest firmware revision
Software: Exact Audio Copy V0.95 beta 4

Other interesting things of some interest:
Use of SCSI interface: Installed external ASPI interface (Adaptec's ASPI v4.60)
Drive read command: Read command D8 (found with 'auto detect read command')
Allow speed reduction during extraction: Checked

Without SPTD installed:

EAC without -usefua

Test 1:
Drive settings:
Drive has 'Accurate Stream' feature: Checked
Drive caches audio data: Unchecked
Drive is capable of C2 data: Unchecked
Results:
Track ripped with NO reported errors (even though there are)

Test 2:
Drive settings:
Drive has 'Accurate Stream' feature: Checked
Drive caches audio data: Checked
Drive is capable of C2 data: Unchecked
Results:
Read error then sync error, then canceled as it was going at .3x.

Test 3:
Drive settings:
Drive has 'Accurate Stream' feature: Checked
Drive caches audio data: Checked
Drive is capable of C2 data: Checked
Results:
Read/sync then canceled

Test 4:
Drive settings:
Drive has 'Accurate Stream' feature: Checked
Drive caches audio data: Unchecked
Drive is capable of C2 data: Checked
Results:
Sync error no read error

EAC with -usefua

Test 1:
Drive settings:
Drive has 'Accurate Stream' feature: Checked
Drive caches audio data: Unchecked
Drive is capable of C2 data: Unchecked
Results:
Read error then sync error. Canceled due to slowness.

Test 2:
Drive settings:
Drive has 'Accurate Stream' feature: Checked
Drive caches audio data: Checked
Drive is capable of C2 data: Unchecked
Results:
Read error then sync error. Canceled due to slowness.

Test 3:
Drive settings:
Drive has 'Accurate Stream' feature: Checked
Drive caches audio data: Checked
Drive is capable of C2 data: Checked
Results:
Read/sync then canceled

Test 4:
Drive settings:
Drive has 'Accurate Stream' feature: Checked
Drive caches audio data: Unchecked
Drive is capable of C2 data: Checked
Results:
Read and sync error reported.

Conclusion thus far:
Well, it seems like Plextor's PX-760A does support -usefua with Exact Audio Copy (afterthought: this may not be new news, lol). This is rather good news, especially for people that would decide to use Test 4's settings as the test started out at 17x.
Now to continue on. We know how the PX-760 acts without the -usefua switch so I'm not going to repeat those tests with SPTD installed (though I will upon request) so I'm going to jump right into the with -usefua switch

With SPTD installed

EAC with -usefua

Test 1:
Drive settings:
Drive has 'Accurate Stream' feature: Checked
Drive caches audio data: Unchecked
Drive is capable of C2 data: Unchecked
Results:
Sync error reported. Doesn't look good.

Test 2:
Drive settings:
Drive has 'Accurate Stream' feature: Checked
Drive caches audio data: Checked
Drive is capable of C2 data: Unchecked
Results:
Read error then sync error. Canceled due to slowness. Nothing new

Test 3:
Drive settings:
Drive has 'Accurate Stream' feature: Checked
Drive caches audio data: Checked
Drive is capable of C2 data: Checked
Results:
Same as Test 2

Test 4:
Drive settings:
Drive has 'Accurate Stream' feature: Checked
Drive caches audio data: Unchecked
Drive is capable of C2 data: Checked
Results:
Sync error reported

Conclusion:
Well, it seems that the newest beta still breaks EAC's -usefua command. I'm going to post this test in the forum, maybe they can do something to address this issue. I'm kinda curious what in SPTD causes this to happen..

Also, I need everyone having problems with SPTD and EAC's -usefua command, I need them to register to the SPTD forum (located here) and post in the 1.47 Public Beta forum that SPTD is breaking -usefua for you. Post your system specs, what kind of drive you have, what adapter and position (I don't know if that's correct terminology) your drive is located on, if you use microsoft's controller drivers or vendor specific... I think we can get this bug worked out if enough of us post that we're having issues.

[greynol]

Great news!

The new 1.49 public beta of SPTD appears to not interfere with EAC's FUA command.

Thanks so much to KusanagiSan1 for bringing the issue to the SPTD developers!

[Red Frog]

EAC 0.99 pb3
Intel 915G/P+ICH6
Native Win32 Interface
Weird Al Yankovic - Bad Hair Day

PX-W1610TA 1.05
USB
No cache detected, -USEFUA operational

PX-W5224TA 1.03
USB
Cache detected, but I think -USFUA is still working.
This drive I have tested on a disc with very bad scratches (plenty of C2 errors), starting EAC without -USEFUA and Drive cache unchecked it reads through the errors very quickly. With -USEFUA and Drive cache unchecked it reads slowly, but not as slow as without -USEFUA and Drive cache checked. I think the command works here but isn't detected properly by EAC.

[greynol]

Originally Posted by Red Frog

EAC 0.99 pb3
Intel 915G/P+ICH6
Native Win32 Interface
Weird Al Yankovic - Bad Hair Day

PX-W1610TA 1.05
USB
No cache detected, -USEFUA operational

PX-W5224TA 1.03
USB
Cache detected, but I think -USFUA is still working.
This drive I have tested on a disc with very bad scratches (plenty of C2 errors), starting EAC without -USEFUA and Drive cache unchecked it reads through the errors very quickly. With -USEFUA and Drive cache unchecked it reads slowly, but not as slow as without -USEFUA and Drive cache checked. I think the command works here but isn't detected properly by EAC.

I really don't like to repeat myself, but I think this fact bears repeating:

EAC's test for caching is not the appropriate way to determine if the FUA command works properly!

The FUA command may actually work even when EAC's test says your drive still caches audio data!!!

[Red Frog]

I know. Which is why I did plenty of testing. I wouldn't have posted that info if I didn't think it'd be useful to the thread. I was just trying my best to follow the outline for that info in the original post.

[greynol]

Ok, thanks.

Your method of testing looked pretty good, actually. It's just that you still seemed uncertain because of EAC's test. This is why I replied the way that I did. I hope you didn't take my response personally; it was directed at everyone. Anyway, I don't know what JeanLuc is trying to accomplish by asking people to report EAC's cache testing results since it proves nothing (depending on the disc I use for testing I can get either result). (See my edit below)

This seems to be a common misconception which has not been adequately addressed in this thread. Lucky2man and EliC's incorrect statements are two examples of this, which until now have not gone unchallenged and unfortunately it appears that a few people even drank the Kool-Aid. Furthermore, EliC's suggestion that EAC's testing for caching is somewhat buggy is based on false assumptions.

Probably the best way I know to test to see if -usefua works is to rip a scratched disc and see if EAC is able to report a read error. At least this is the method that is the easiest to explain in absolute terms.

@JeanLuc:
If you're still following this thread I recommend you edit your initial post so that people don't use EAC's test for caching to determine whether -usefua works.

EDIT: I'm probably being too critical of JeanLuc's post since my first and experience with the cache test and the FUA command was that it still said my drive caches audio data although re-reading behavior clearly indicates that the command is working properly. A while had passed before I ever encountered a situation where the cache test said my drive did not cache audio data. If my experiences were different I may have formed an opinion more along the lines of what others have been saying; at least initially.

[JeanLuc]

Originally Posted by greynol

@JeanLuc:
If you're still following this thread I recommend you edit your initial post so that people don't use EAC's test for caching to determine whether -usefua works.

Just did so ... but IMO, the EAC cache test is still needed to check whether the command is being accepted at all or not. But there's nothing like a "hot test" with a damaged medium.

[greynol]

Originally Posted by JeanLuc

the EAC cache test is still needed to check whether the command is being accepted at all or not.

I strongly disagree. So long as the EAC says your drive caches audio data and the FUA command is clearly working, this test is worthless. I might never have found a disc that caused EAC's test to say my drive didn't cache audio data and therefore would never have had any confirmation that the command was "being accepted".

EAC's ability to report a read error is the proper metric and I want to acknowledge that you were the one who opened my eyes to this.

The only other method that I trust is cachex.exe, which must score no less than 5 out of 5. It's probably a good idea to increase the number of attempts (perhaps 16 or more) and verify that you still get 100% results. FWIW, I do not trust dBpowerAMP's test for FUA because I found a drive (JLMS XJ-HD166S) that does not properly utilize the command (based on ripping behavior in both dBpA and EAC; and based on Cache Explorer's test) even though dBpA says it doesn't cache with the setting enabled.

[valnar]

Does anyone know if this bug has been fixed in later versions of Daemon Tools and SPTD? I think they are up to SPTD 1.56 now.

Robert

[Berki]

I also would be interested if I can install Deamon Tools without fearing to loose the -usefua support...

Any infos on this topic would be much appreciated!

[greynol]

Try and find out.

[Berki]

Tried it out and it seems to work. When detecting Drive Features with a heavily scratched CD EAC says "buffering yes" without usefua and no with.

[greynol]

It would seem you haven't read what was right above your post. That's not the proper way to check to see if -usefua is working.

You either need to rip a scratched disc and make sure EAC can report a read error, or test it with cachex:
http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/...howtopic=64310